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What's New at WSLS
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| Check out the Problem Corner site Jerry Mahun has created for an opportunity to see solutions for the Problem Corner in the Wisconsin Professional Surveyor. We will be award a prize at the end of the year.
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| I added the current draft of the continuing education rule on the Legislative page.
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My thoughts from yesterdays hearing on the Definition of law
practice. There was a lively discussion between the Justices regarding 3 major issues 1) The definition of practicing law
2) Consumer Protection 3) Enforcement 1) It was decided that the proposal before them was close on the issues of definition I believe the following was the version they had before them. http://wicourts.gov/supreme/docs/0709revision.pdf For surveyors the following language is the most problematic
including (a), (b) & (d).
(a)
Giving advice or counsel to others as to their legal rights or the legal rights
or responsibilities of others for fees or other consideration.
(b) Selection, drafting, or completion for another entity or person of legal documents or agreements which affect the legal rights of the other entity or person(s). (c) Representation of another entity or person(s) in a court, or in a formal administrative adjudicative proceeding or other formal dispute resolution process or in an administrative adjudicative proceeding in which legal pleadings are filed or a record is established as the basis for judicial review. (d) Negotiation of legal rights or responsibilities on behalf of another entity or person(s). There where 4 groups that the S.C. felt need special consideration Accounting, Financial Institutions, Real Estate and Insurance. Many individuals within these professions do quasi legal work. So the issue of the rights to practice within professional employment is something that some felt was addressed fairly below. When I left they where going to go through this entire proposal line by line so it is fair to expect some changes. SCR 23.02 License required to practice law; use of titles. (n) Governmental agencies and their employees carrying out responsibilities provided by law. (o) Practicing within the scope of practice allowed by a current credential issued under Stats. chs. 440 to 480 provided that the Supreme Court has not determined by rule or by published opinion that the activity constitutes the unlicensed or unauthorized practice of law. (y) Teaching about the law or providing information about the law including the legal rights or responsibilities of persons under the law, in a manner that is not directed at providing specific legal advice to a specific individual in the context of a specific matter. Since surveying is governed under s. 443 we do seem to have some protection. S. 443.01 (4) “Land surveying” means any service comprising the determination of the location of land boundaries and land boundary corners; the preparation of maps showing the shape and area of tracts of land and their subdivisions into smaller tracts; the preparation of maps showing the layout of roads, streets and rights−of−way of same to give access to smaller tracts; and the preparation of official plats, or maps, of land in this state. 2) The discussion did include the idea that the consumer protection issues should be through s. 100.18 fraudulent representations, and in particular: s.100.18 (1) No person, firm, corporation
or association, or agent or employee thereof, with intent to sell, distribute,
increase the consumption of or in any wise dispose of any real estate,
merchandise, securities, employment, service, or anything offered by such
person, firm, corporation or association, or agent or employee thereof,
directly or indirectly, to the public for sale, hire, use or other
distribution, or with intent to induce the public in any manner to enter into
any contract or obligation relating to the purchase, sale, hire, use or lease
of any real estate, merchandise, securities, employment or service, shall make,
publish, disseminate, circulate, or place before the public, or cause, directly
or indirectly, to be made, published, disseminated, circulated, or placed
before the public, in this state, in a newspaper, magazine or other
publication, or in the form of a book, notice, handbill, poster, bill,
circular, pamphlet, letter, sign, placard, card, label, or over any radio or
television station, or in any other way similar or dissimilar to the foregoing,
an advertisement, announcement, statement or representation of any kind to the
public relating to such purchase, sale, hire, use or lease of such real estate,
merchandise, securities, service or employment or to the terms or conditions
thereof, which advertisement, announcement, statement or representation
contains any assertion, representation or statement of fact which is untrue,
deceptive or misleading.
Additional legislation may be recommended to more specifically address the issues at hand. 3) Enforcement was a very contentious part of the discussion; who would have the authority? How should cases be handled? How would the program be funded? They obviously did not want to create an unfunded or under funded
mandate.
Wisconsin Bar seems to want the office of Lawyer Regulation involved. That office does not want to because the regulation may not apply to lawyers and they don’t have the staff or resources. There was a discussion of a Private Attorney General to bring lawsuits on behalf of the public but details would need to be worked out. Another option would be for the Bar to enforce it. The Bar probably would not support this since it would seem to be a conflict of interest or monopolization. Possibly DA’s and Corp Councils would be asked to act in the enforcement; financial interests may be a hurdle in this course as well. Enforcement was deemed to be too difficult for this session. It was decided that it would be taken up at a later date, in as timely matter as possible with more research and input to be considered. Unfortunately I could not attend the entire session due to prior commitments. The Wisconsin Eye Cameras where on so maybe the video will be available soon. http://wisconsineye.com/ WisBar had the agenda and supporting documents available: http://www.wisbar.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=News&template=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&contentid=75191 I expect they will have additional documents soon. Jim
Logan |
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Another marathon day in the Supreme Court. Following
receipt of a document from staff of the Supreme Court that recommended denial of
the Bar's petition, Justice Gableman made a motion to deny the petition. It
failed on a 3 to 4 vote. It was very apparent that the chief justice wants to do
something about the practice of law.
Another public hearing will be held sometime in the Spring
to look at this issue in a different light asking for specific suggestions for
enforcement. The Office of Lawyer Regulation is off the table as the enforcer.
There are some specific groups the court feels needs to be heard from. Whether
it's because there are no real issues with engineers or we didn't make a clear
case, design professionals are not included in these specific
groups.
Additional information will be sent from the Court shortly
to all interested parties.
Carol
Godiksen
Executive Director |
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| Institute Vendor information can be found by Clicking Institute Vendors
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WSLS is forming an online list of Surveying firms and Professional Land Surveyors who provide land surveying services in one, two or more counties. Our members database is not available on line and not all members want to be contacted. If you are interested in being on the list, Please down load the .pdf Application form by clicking below. Fill it out and email or mail it to the Executive Director listed on the contacts page. I will create lists of firms with members of WSLS that can be either scanned on line or downloaded and printed. Application Form Francis R. Thousand
Executive Director Wisconsin Society of Land Surveyors 5113 Spaanem Ave Madison, WI 53716 fthousand@charter.net Phone (608)770-9759 Phone (608) 222-6152
Fax (608)222-6152 Call First
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| In 1974 WSLS published "General
Instructiona and State Laws Governing the Original Government Survey of
Wisconsin" by Percival "Tom" Sprague. In 2007 it was published
again. In the 2007 version. page 189 was skiped. We are
working on correcting the missing page in all future printings of the
book. For those who have already purchased the book please go to
the publications page to download a pdf file of the missing page.
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General Web Site Information: Many of the documents on the web site are only available in the Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF). The Adobe Acrobat Reader will allow you to view these files and can be obtained free of charge from the following link: |
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